Driving a manual car

[slikrapid]

@cheatos:

- On a normal street

1. Push the clutch and break to the max
2. Turn on the car via the switcher
3. Put the gear on Neutral (it should be on 1st from last turn off)
4. Move the hand break down
5. Put the gear on 1st
6. Remove leg from the break
7. Remove leg from clutch slowly
8. The car moves forward

- on a normal street/terrain with negligible slope it is not necessary to push the brake since the car won't move anywhere - also, in this case it is not necessary to use the handbrake while the car is parked and turned off, putting the gear in 1st is sufficient to counter any minor movement possibility in either direction (forward or backward)
- the clutch is always pushed to the max when switching gears
- to reduce wear(ing) of the clutch pedal mechanism it is advisable to use it fairly 'swiftly' (meaning avoiding to keep it depressed for longer periods of time) - use it and relatively soon afterward release it, don't get the habit of 'sitting' on the clutch
- to prevent unnecessary wear(ing) of the handbrake it is advisable to use it only on more inclined slopes or uneven terrain, not all the time

another way, less complicated (might not be precisely as required by the regulations):

0. the car is parked (no slope or negligible slope), turned off, in the 1st gear, handbrake released
1. put the gear in neutral (use the clutch for that: push-switch-release), turn on the car
2. push the clutch, switch the gear to 1st, give it some gas (push the gas pedal)
3. = 7. & 8. as above

-On a hill

1. Push the clutch and break to the max
2. Turn on the car via the switcher
3. Put the gear on Neutral (it should be on 1st from last turn off)
4. Move the hand break down
5. Put the gear on 1st
6. Remove leg from the break
7. Remove leg from clutch slowly until you reach the friction point (the car will start to shake)
8. Immediatly remove leg from break and push on Gas (a small amount) and lift your leg a bit from the clutch
9. The car begins to move forward, apply more gas until you reach the top
10. Push the clutch again and switch to 2nd
11. You are on a main street now

0. the car is parked (the front side of the car facing the top of the hill), turned off, in the 1st gear, handbrake on
...
8.1. give it a bit more gas than on a normal street
9.1 you can switch to 2nd (and so on) on the slope too, if the car can go faster without having trouble maintaining/increasing speed (ie. if its not an extreme slope)

-On a down hill

1. Push the clutch and break to the max
2. Turn on the car via the switcher
3. Put the gear on Neutral (it should be on 1st from last turn off)
4. Move the hand break down
5. Put the gear on 1st
6. Remove leg from the break
7. Remove leg from clutch half lift
8. You are moving now, apply little breaks until you are on "normal" street.

0. the car is parked (the front side of the car facing the bottom of the hill), turned off, in the reverse gear, handbrake on
8. apply brakes only if the car is starting to move too fast regarding the road conditions (extreme slope, slower cars in front,...)

Stopping the car

1. If you are on 3rd then down shift to the first by doing this:
(use the breaks (small amount) and keep your leg on them, push the clutch to max, down shift to 2nd, lift your leg from the clutch (half lift), (remember: you are still breaking), push the clutch to max again, down shift to 1st and keep your leg on the clutch, apply more break until the car fully stops)
2. Move the break up
3. Put the gear on Neutral
4. Switch off the car
5. Put the gear back on 1st
6. Remove leg from break and clutch

0. 3rd gear & moving
1. push the brake, leaving the gear a bit more in the 3rd and going directly to the 1st after the speed got sufficiently reduced (or directly to neutral if stopping completely), no need to go through all the gears in between
2. if you're already in the neutral gear, no need to push the clutch again, just brake until the car stops & turn it off
3. put the gear in 1st (use the clutch for that: push-switch-release), done

Special Notes:

1. Never remove your leg from the clutch on 1st
2. If you are coming to a complete stop the push the clutch to max so the car won't stop (this applies at any gear)
3. Push gently on gas,break and move the steering gently
4. Never move the HB up OR push the break to max unless it's necessary (a kid appeared in front of you for example)
5. After shifting gears, remove your leg half up the slowly continue until the clutch pedal is fully up.
6. Don't use the switch for too long or you'll screw it up
7. It's recommened to shift gears up after (2.5*1000 rpms OR 3.5*1000 rpms on hills)
8. Everyone else is stupid, deal with driving like you deal with idiots and you should never crash.(Means, drive slowly and carefully and watch out for noobs).

1. never do it too quickly, but not too slowly either - both scenarios increasingly wear the clutch
2. yes, so the car won't turn off as it starts having trouble maintaining its rpm
3. unless you want to: stop fast, accelerate quickly or avoid an obstacle quickly
6. ie. don't keep 'sitting' on the clutch pedal
7. depending on the car's operating rpm range, but you can hear the engine is getting too loud (high time to switch the gear)
8. use your intelligence - drive safely, but don't let the safety become an obsession - drive carefully, but don't become paranoid about it - have fun driving, but don't become careless about it - be patient with other drivers or pedestrians, no need to exercise aggression, its sufficiently stressful as it is - no driver is really an idiot, if they behave so its because they forgot to leave their issues behind, basically they chose to behave that way, which only shows the level of their manners/culture
9. the above applies mostly to gasoline/petrol engines, less for diesel ones

Gears notes:

1. 1st is for starting/going up extreme hills/stopping(complete stops)
2. 2nd is for going into a circle, going left/right, hills(unless it's extreme, use 1st), intersections.
3. 3rd is for cities
4. 4th is for high speed empty streets
5. 5th is for ???

1. going down extreme hills too
2. going up/down less extreme hills too
5. higher speeds (direct gear) or better fuel economy cruising speeds (overdrive gear)
reverse gear - is for going in reverse, complete stops on down-hills (always counter the expected movement of the parked car)

basically, the gears have their own 'ideal' ranges of speed within which they may operate in a satisfactory way - generally, the higher the car speed, the higher the gear - no need to memorize these ranges, just listen to the engine and estimate whether it feels 'right'

Why would you move the gear from 1st to neutral and then back to first? Doesn't make much sense to me...
You don't need to put your gearbox into neutral to push the handbrake down...
...Perhaps it's a precaution
...As long as you don't do this, just pushing down the clutch is enough.

yes, it was meant to be done before turning the car on, ie. not turning it on while the gear is still in the 1st - its useful if one failed to fully push the clutch at the time of ignition, for prolonging clutch pedal 'lifetime', when the car won't start immediately,... i'd call it a good measure

you do that 'friction point' thing everytime you come to a complete stop ?

every time you switch gears expecting to start or keep on moving - the engine has to connect with the rest of the transmission, which is done through friction (as a temporary 'state', switching between 2 stable 'states' of being fully connected or fully disconnected)

I won't do that, ever.

it (that kind of sliding) might nevertheless happen due to fi. heavier snow on the road, especially in corners, while going a bit too fast (or too light, or without winter equipment)

you have to remember that he's learning to drive. he needs to do things by the book until he passes his test...

Anyway, like tako said, do things like they tell you to until you actually pass. If the instructor says to do it that way, just do it.

exactly

later on you'll notice that these steps (or their order) are not something set in stone or necessary or unavoidable, ie. you'll be applying them in order to suit your 'needs', while still being reasonably close to what is done in a by-the-book fashion

Perhaps a more accurate description of
gear 3 is: "the middle gear, because after it is high speeds and before it slow speeds"
gear 2 is: "the acceleration gear"
gear 4 is: "the economic gear"

The instructor said the above descriptions,

the 3rd gear has a wide range and may be (temporarily) used for both low or high speeds, thats why its called the middle one (not necessarily in the middle when considering gear numbers)

For the gear you should look at rPM not at speed.

'look at' rpm when deciding: when to switch gears
'look at' speed when deciding: in which gear to switch

and if the hill is long, you'll eventually need to gear down

you meant steep

[Sazzy]

you meant steep

Pretty sure she meant long, eg: if it's uphill for like 2-3km, don't stay in second gear.

[yoco]

3rd is when you can drive 35-40 km/h and over.
4th is when you can drive 60 km/h and over.
5th is when you can drive 80 km/h and over.

No gear for number six?

In my car 6th gear is at 85+ km/h

[Sazzy]

In my car 6th gear is at 85+ km/h

I think 6th gear is meant to switch to when you hit a speed over 100km/h that you'll be driving at for a while (most likely 120), in other words, when you finish accelerating. Since you usually only switch to 5th gear around 80, it would surprise me to go to 6th at 85 already. Most cars have pretty shitty acceleration in 5th gear, let alone 6th At leatst that's how the instructor told it to me.

Isn't the 6th gear that typical extra gear to save fuel when driving on the motorway?

[yoco]

That's what I thought at first. When driving my car shows you the best time for shifting to another gear, and 6th comes straight at 85km/h.

[slikrapid]

Pretty sure she meant long, eg: if it's uphill for like 2-3km, don't stay in second gear.

think about it, the length of the hill is just the distance one needs to travel, however the angle of its inclination is what requires additional gas - if its a reasonably small angle, all it takes to cover the distance (at some desired speed which would have been used on a normal road without inclination) is to push the gas pedal a little more and keep it depressed in/around this new position - thus one wouldn't have to shift down regardless of the length of the hill

Most cars have pretty shitty acceleration in 5th gear, let alone 6th At leatst that's how the instructor told it to me.

well, they are limited regarding the available power/energy of the engine, equal acceleration at higher speeds requires additional energy and the upper gears can't supply the same amount of force (ie. moment of force) as the lower ones due to increased car speed


additional/related discussion:

from
http://www.sb-innovation.de/showthre...561#post273909
to
http://www.sb-innovation.de/showthre...563#post274040

[Sazzy]

I was just writing this whole block of text, while i read "shift down" in yours. Somewhere along the way I read shift up (which would be logical if it's length related).

[cheatos]

For the gear you should look at rPM not at speed. And the speed is different at every car you drive.

I look at the RPM clock and hear the engine.
And yes, I know cars differ from each other, so in that case you hear the engine, then memorize at which RPM you should shitf.

IMHO a forum is not the best way for learn better how to drive a car.

I know, I take RL driving lessons, just wanted to talk a bit about driving in the days I don't have a lesson.

PS: I started to try drive at 12 years old... at 14 years old I learned to drive almost all veicles. Of course I didn't it in public road... but if we want to tell the whole truth came out on the road for short distances even before you 18 years

I really don't understand the rush towards driving, I mean, driving could be fun, but think about the tasks you'll be given because you are a driver; deliver that, buy X KG tomatoes ..etc

Sorry for bad english.

It isn't bad.

He's not learning to drive here, he's just asking for extra hints and tips and imho, showing that kind of determination is the way to go.

Yep!

You can use 2 or 3 while driving up a hill. To do so, one must have enough speed and if the hill is long, you'll eventually need to gear down (2). Most of the time you don't need to use 1st. I would say using 2nd coupled with a bit more speed before the hill, is alright for you

I see, I once was at 4th, the car began to slow down as if it was dying, I shifted down to 3 and it went up.

No gear for number six?

Isn't that for 'sport cars' ?, the training car doesn't have a 6th gear, plus when I was at 4th the car was about to take off!!


@slikrapid

Thanks for the corrections/notes, I've added some of them to my text book.

0. 3rd gear & moving
1. push the brake, leaving the gear a bit more in the 3rd and going directly to the 1st after the speed got sufficiently reduced (or directly to neutral if stopping completely), no need to go through all the gears in between
2. if you're already in the neutral gear, no need to push the clutch again, just brake until the car stops & turn it off
3. put the gear in 1st (use the clutch for that: push-switch-release), done

I asked the instructor about this and he said "leave it a bit, for now down shift a gear one by one".

yes, it was meant to be done before turning the car on, ie. not turning it on while the gear is still in the 1st - its useful if one failed to fully push the clutch at the time of ignition, for prolonging clutch pedal 'lifetime', when the car won't start immediately,... i'd call it a good measure

Yes, I asked and it was a safety measure, he also told me "no need to do it any more unless you like wasting time starting the car ".

In my car 6th gear is at 85+ km/h

Yes, in your car.
"My" traning car uses 4th gear for 90km/h speed.
Is it an old car ? something like < 1990 or < 1980 ?

=============

Thanks all for commenting , I'm very thankful.

[yoco]

Yes, in your car.
"My" traning car uses 4th gear for 90km/h speed.
Is it an old car ? something like < 1990 or < 1980 ?

LOL, what kind of car are you driving? When I was making my driving license I drove brand new VW Golf 5, that was 6 years ago! I'm surprised your's so old!

[Snitlev]

oO Cheatos what have you done, that's wrong ^^

[Sazzy]

I really don't understand the rush towards driving,

Imho, there really shouldn't be a rush.

First you have to learn how to be responsible enough. Imho, wanting to rush into it is a sign that you're not. And let's face it, a lot of people aren't responsible enough at that age (the youngest legal age to drive). I still don't understand why you can learn how to drive an iron killing machine weighing a few tons when you're as young as 16 in the states, possibly killing many people along the way, but you can't drink a beer until you're 21 (FIVE full years later) and at most just kill yourself. It's insane, if you ask me!

I personally only learned how to drive at 21, which I admit is pretty late. It wasn't an issue of being responsible, though, more an issue of needing it or not. Before that, I couldn't afford a car, could hardly use my parents car and had to take the bus or train everywhere anyway. So I just found it pointless to rush into it and not be able to use it. The driver instructor told me it's better to wait long, like I did, and be responsible enough to drive. That kind of cheered me up

Today I drive daily for work related things and spend more than 2 hours each day in my car, driving over 100km ^^

[slikrapid]

I really don't understand the rush towards driving

i'd say 'bragging rights' might count for a large part of (very) young 'drivers', other than that its useful to know something about it or have some experience with it before one enters a driving school, as it can be an advantage, as opposed to the situation of fi. total beginners

Isn't that for 'sport cars' ?, the training car doesn't have a 6th gear,

5. or 6. gear: higher speeds (direct gear) or better fuel economy cruising speeds (overdrive gear)

"My" traning car uses 4th gear for 90km/h speed.
Is it an old car ? something like < 1990 or < 1980 ?

older cars had 4 gears (not counting the reverse), nowadays afaik the standard is 5-6

I still don't understand why you can learn how to drive an iron killing machine weighing a few tons when you're as young as 16 in the states, possibly killing many people along the way, but you can't drink a beer until you're 21 (FIVE full years later) and at most just kill yourself. It's insane, if you ask me!

imo 18 is a reasonable age for both with perhaps a year under that limit for special cases

iron...killing machine...possibly killing many people along the way...at most just kill yourself...licentia 'poetica'?

agreed, the difference is drastic and pretty much pointless, unless the reason is actually to encourage prolonged counterproductive youth behavior (as long as they have the restriction, the usage of alcohol will remain largely excessive and part of the rebellious attitude) in order to have/create a permanent or prolonged problem that needs to be constantly addressed (a common practice regarding political & societal issues, among others)

[Sazzy]

imo 18 is a reasonable age for both with perhaps a year under that limit for special cases

A lot of the cases, yes. Though I know a few 18 year olds (cousins and their friends) that shouldn't be allowed to drive ... Just yet.

One of the reasons I think this way now more than I used to is because there are quite some fatal teen accidents in my neighbourhood lately. The last one, shockingly, was 18 years old and had his drivers license for one full week. 3 passengers, all 4 died after he drove into a house, drunk. It's so sad and disgusting at the same time, really.

iron...killing machine...possibly killing many people along the way...at most just kill yourself...licentia 'poetica'?

*shmiley face*

agreed, the difference is drastic and pretty much pointless, unless the reason is actually to encourage prolonged counterproductive youth behavior (as long as they have the restriction, the usage of alcohol will remain largely excessive and part of the rebellious attitude) in order to have/create a permanent or prolonged problem that needs to be constantly addressed (a common practice regarding political & societal issues, among others)

Might be, yes. But don't you want the things you can't have even more :) ? I know I used to drink a lot more as a teen than I do now. (which is practically nothing, at most one beer the entire evening, as I drive everywhere. Even if I don't drive, I don't miss it nor need it while it was the first thing we did when I was back in high school)

[sprite]

Why would you move the gear from 1st to neutral and then back to first? Doesn't make much sense to me...
You don't need to put your gearbox into neutral to push the handbrake down... Same goes for stopping the car. It's unnecessary and I can't figure out why you're doing that.

Besides, pushing the clutch down is the same as being in neutral.

Also, after removing your foot from the brake, gently push down the accelerator as well rather than just slowly remove your foot from the clutch (at the same time)

I also wouldn't treat gears the way you're doing (aka 1st gear is for X). Just try to stick to the other note you made about the rpm. Then you'll always be in the correct gear. If your rpm is starting to be too low, shift a gear down and reapply the rule.

In Cheatos defence; the section was about Hill Starts.

In many older cars or in extreme circumstances you would leave the vehicle in 1st gear to assist the handbrake. Otherwise you may return to where you left the vehicle only to find it at the bottom of a hill.

Cheatos, in what country are you learning to drive? Here in the UK we have rather strict driving tests (though some other countries have even more stringent rules). But what us rather interesting is that anyone who is not native to the UK is allowed to drive for 6 months without getting a UK driving licence - some of the things I've seen... wow.

[yoco]

Cheatos, in what country are you learning to drive? Here in the UK we have rather strict driving tests (though some other countries have even more stringent rules). But what us rather interesting is that anyone who is not native to the UK is allowed to drive for 6 months without getting a UK driving licence - some of the things I've seen... wow.

So if I'd move to UK I could drive with my license for 6 months and then I'd have to take yours?