Cheating on What.cd ?

[Lokare]

Well, yes.. I remember what you've said.
But sometimes the average swarm speed goes very low but I'm still uploading at a higher speed than It.

[anon]

@post #119: remember that the swarm speed is used as the lower bound for your fake upload when the "Use the swarm's average speed as..."; you still have to set a maximum yourself. This way you could set the maximum to the max fake speed you want and enabling intelligent mode (this is how I'd handle it) to make sure it doesn't go too much higher than the swarm's speed.

@Aurion: I don't know the maximum speed you can fake at Waffles without being detected yet, so I can't say whether your tip is correct or not. But you mention having a 100kbs upload speed while faking a 200-250kbs one. What if you're asked for a speed test..?

[Lokare]

@post #119: remember that the swarm speed is used as the lower bound for your fake upload when the "Use the swarm's average speed as..."; you still have to set a maximum yourself. This way you could set the maximum to the max fake speed you want and enabling intelligent mode (this is how I'd handle it) to make sure it doesn't go too much higher than the swarm's speed.

Yeap, I know about the things that will change when I'm using that option.
I've also come over alot situations where alot of the leechers are actually not downloading more than 1kB/s and are partial seeding. What settings should I use when It's something like that?

And I was wondering what Is the exact meaning of 'Swarm Average Speed' when I'm a peer or a seeder? Does It means If I'm downloading from 10 seeds/peers @ 400 kB/s as a leecher, will it be a result of 40 kB/s of average speed on my leeching list?

If me and other 9 seeders are seeding a torrent, and the total speed of our seeding Is 400 kB/s would It mean that the swarm average speed be 40 kB/s shown on my seeding list?

[Aurion]

@Aurion: I don't know the maximum speed you can fake at Waffles without being detected yet, so I can't say whether your tip is correct or not. But you mention having a 100kbs upload speed while faking a 200-250kbs one. What if you're asked for a speed test..?

Well,I don't care what tracker to use such settings,Waffles,What or whatever,that's not my point,I was talking in general tho...if he still have 100KB/s so he should do 200~250KB/s on high s/l ratio torrents,man I've said for million times before,so I guess it's too clear to get.

And I was wondering what Is the exact meaning of 'Swarm Average Speed' when I'm a peer or a seeder? Does It means If I'm downloading from 10 seeds/peers @ 400 kB/s as a leecher, will it be a result of 40 kB/s of average speed on my leeching list?

First,to be definite,the Swarm Average Speed is "The average swarm speed is calculated by measuring the interval between have-messages and the amount of data they represent you get from your peers (the estimated download speed column in the peers view is based on that information, too). Then the calculated peer speed (including your own) is divided by the number of peers you're connected to. "

As per the above definition,I would assume that when you are downloading good torrents and have good Azureus settings you should be able to get something between one and eight times the Average Swarm Speed - it's also partly depending on your upload speed to the swarm.for example if you only upload 5 kb/s don't expect to be able to get 50 kb/s back. Remember: this is file-sharing, not file-downloading.

If me and other 9 seeders are seeding a torrent, and the total speed of our seeding Is 400 kB/s would It mean that the swarm average speed be 40 kB/s shown on my seeding list?

Well,I won't answer that directly tho,instead I will explain it in another way....now if you are among other 9 seeders,and the total seeding speed is 400KB/s so it won't be reasonable to set a speed of higher than 100KB/s (based on your actual uploading speed which is 450KB/s),you will ask how come to set 1/4 the total speed ? Yeah,I guess someone should be having the main gaz tank valve to drop more oil spots....that's why you might pick a speed ranging between 80~100KB/s with max of 100KB/s....

[anon]

I've also come over alot situations where alot of the leechers are actually not downloading more than 1kB/s and are partial seeding. What settings should I use when It's something like that?

When that happened to me I went for a 5-10kB/s speed and intelligent mode on, and they worked fine.

And I was wondering what Is the exact meaning of 'Swarm Average Speed' when I'm a peer or a seeder? Does It means If I'm downloading from 10 seeds/peers @ 400 kB/s as a leecher, will it be a result of 40 kB/s of average speed on my leeching list?

If me and other 9 seeders are seeding a torrent, and the total speed of our seeding Is 400 kB/s would It mean that the swarm average speed be 40 kB/s shown on my seeding list?

The average swarm speed isn't shown at your Waffles profile page. The download rate shown there is calculated like this:

( amount of uploaded bytes / tracker announce interval ) / 1024

For example:
Uploaded bytes: 104857600 (100 MB)
Announce interval: 3600 seconds (1 hour)

Uploaded / interval = 29127 bytes per second
29127 bytes / 1024 = 28kB/s (rounded down)

Now, if you do:

(28 * 1024) * 3600

You should end up with 103219200, approximately your amount of reported uploaded bytes.

Well,I don't care what tracker to use such settings,Waffles,What or whatever,that's not my point,I was talking in general tho...if he still have 100KB/s so he should do 200~250KB/s on high s/l ratio torrents,man I've said for million times before,so I guess it's too clear to get.

Have you tried to fake at 250kB/s on Waffles yourself?

First,to be definite,the Swarm Average Speed is "The average swarm speed is calculated by measuring the interval between have-messages and the amount of data they represent you get from your peers (the estimated download speed column in the peers view is based on that information, too). Then the calculated peer speed (including your own) is divided by the number of peers you're connected to. "

As per the above definition,I would assume that when you are downloading good torrents and have good Azureus settings you should be able to get something between one and eight times the Average Swarm Speed - it's also partly depending on your upload speed to the swarm.for example if you only upload 5 kb/s don't expect to be able to get 50 kb/s back. Remember: this is file-sharing, not file-downloading.

That's so AzureusWiki But of course true.

[Aurion]

The download rate shown there is calculated like this:

( amount of uploaded bytes / tracker announce interval ) / 1024

For example:
Uploaded bytes: 104857600 (100 MB)
Announce interval: 3600 seconds (1 hour)

Uploaded / interval = 29127 bytes per second
29127 bytes / 1024 = 28kB/s (rounded down)

Now, if you do:

(28 * 1024) * 3600

You should end up with 103219200, approximately your amount of reported uploaded bytes.

And what you call that ? Azureus Tutoring ? Still true too

Have you tried to fake at 250kB/s on Waffles yourself?

I didn't actually,but I'm talking general since I know I can handle it wherever I want,even in the Bloody former Oink,I can !

That's so AzureusWiki But of course true.

Aren't we in the middle of Azureus's tutorial here ?

[anon]

And what you call that ? Azureus Tutoring ? Still true too

No, I call it exposing the inner workings of trackers' avg. download rate calculation

I didn't actually,but I'm talking general since I know I can handle it wherever I want,even in the Bloody former Oink,I can !

That's what I meant. I have absolutely no problem with you handling your faking like this , but we'd need to check if your way works on Waffles before.

[Aurion]

No, I call it exposing the inner workings of trackers' avg. download rate calculation

LOL whateva !

That's what I meant. I have absolutely no problem with you handling your faking like this , but we'd need to check if your way works on Waffles before.

Still,I'm pretty positive that this current technique would work on Waffles too regardless not being a member there yet.....

[anon]

Still,I'm pretty positive that this current technique would work on Waffles too regardless not being a member there yet.....

OK. Try it as soon as you get an invite

[Lokare]

first,to be definite,the swarm average speed is "the average swarm speed is calculated by measuring the interval between have-messages and the amount of data they represent you get from your peers (the estimated download speed column in the peers view is based on that information, too). Then the calculated peer speed (including your own) is divided by the number of peers you're connected to. "

Wow, I took quite some time to absorb this. Does It means that
'Avg. Swarm Speed' when listed as a leecher Is calculated by the amount
of data me (leecher) has gotten.

'Avg. Swarm Speed' when listed as a seeder Is divided to the number of active
peers which I am connected to?

Alright! I think I got the meaning thanks to you, I'll somewhat try to use the option If the torrent doesn't looks very safe.

When that happened to me I went for a 5-10kB/s speed and intelligent mode on, and they worked fine.

Oh, ok. Short sentence but very valuable to my survival at Waffles, appreciated It.

The average swarm speed isn't shown at your Waffles profile page. The download rate shown there is calculated like this:

I read the formula and I think I've read It before somewhere on the Internet,
but It looks understandable though. Alright then, I'll try to go for a somewhat faster speed and tell you the results.

[anon]

Wow, I took quite some time to absorb this. Does It means that
'Avg. Swarm Speed' when listed as a leecher Is calculated by the amount
of data me (leecher) has gotten.

'Avg. Swarm Speed' when listed as a seeder Is divided to the number of active
peers which I am connected to?

According my interpretation of the definition, it is calculated by measuring how much it takes for peers to transfer the data they claim to have starting the timer when their first have-message (BitTorrent protocol) is received.

For example:

• Peer A sends a have-message to me, stating he has 2MB of the torrent.
  
  
• If I'm a leecher:
  
  • I connect to him. He starts uploading to me.
• If I'm a seeder:
  
  • He connects to me and I start uploading to him.
  
  
  
• It takes him 20 seconds to transfer the 2MB.
  
• 2048 / 20 = 102,4 - so his average upload (if I'm a leecher) or download (if I'm a seeder) speed is 102,4kB/s.

This is calculated for every peer that connects and sends a HAVE-message to me, and then divided by the total amount of connected peers. The resulting figure is the average swarm speed.

[Lokare]

(?) Peers/ (?) Total Peers = Avg. Swarm Speed?

[anon]

No; if:

KBs transferred = KBT,
Time taken for transfer between have-message and completion = TT,
Calculated average speed for every peer = AVG1,
Sum of all AVG1s = AVG2, and
Amount of connected peers = ACP,

the formula would be:

KBT / TT = AVG1

(AVG2 * ACP) / ACP = average swarm speed

I know it's a bit difficult

[Lokare]

No; if:

KBs transferred = KBT,
Time taken for transfer between have-message and completion = TT,
Calculated average speed for every peer = AVG1,
Sum of all AVG1s = AVG2, and
Amount of connected peers = ACP,

the formula would be:

KBT / TT = AVG1

(AVG2 * ACP) / ACP = average swarm speed

I know it's a bit difficult

Yeah, It's starting to confuse me like math. I'll try to stick It Inside my thick head I gues, thanks for the explanations. I've been looking at peer lists In Waffles and lots of them manage to upload at a higher speed even when other peers have U/L speeds below are uploading at 1kB/s or such.

[anon]

I've been looking at peer lists In Waffles and lots of them manage to upload at a higher speed even when other peers have U/L speeds below are uploading at 1kB/s or such.

Yes, the average swarm speed is just a rough estimate, since as I've said before you can't connect to all peers in the swarm when there are 2000+ of them and calculate each one's transfer rates. So it's possible for others to upload "faster" or "slower" than it.