+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 4 of 4

Thread: Al Jazeera English: Overseas French reject autonomy

  1. #1
    Retired Seal
    SealLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    03.05.08
    Location
    The Arctic--Believe it!!
    Posts
    2,079
    Activity Longevity
    0/20 19/20
    Today Posts
    0/5 sssss2079

    Al Jazeera English: Overseas French reject autonomy

    Hey kiddies!!!!

    I thought that I'd bring news from the sunny climes of the Caribbean this time,yea??

    check it out:

    Voters in the French Caribbean exclaves of Martinique and French Guiana have rejected a proposal for local government to have more autonomy from France.
    Well, good for them, I guess because some of the people there apparently had some rioting over low wages, social problems, and rotting fish still hanging from the rafters.

    Why did the rioting take place??
    Beats me, but apparantly, Nicolas Sarkozy, the French president had it in for himself at one point with the residents there.

    Sarkozy proposed holding the referendums when he travelled to Martinique in June as part of a drive to mend ties following the strike which degenerated into weeks of rioting at the start of 2009.
    So the people there decided to keep things as they have 'em right now.

    There are other reasons as well, of course...

    I don't trust the people who lead the regional council and the general council, ( one resident said)......., referring to the local bodies that govern Martinique
    But I think that one of the major drives ensuring that the referendum was defeated could be b/c of this here:


    Martinique, which has around 400,000 residents, and French Guiana, a vast territory with some 200,000 residents, continue to face social problems including high unemployment and low wages
    Now I'm not saying that these are the reasons but potential reasons why the referendum was defeated.
    People want to ensure that the social benefits they currently are legally entitled as per citizenship status, could be one of the major reasons keeping the referendum defeated.

    With a more autonomous government in the region, the cash flow could change...perhaps.

    People like their social benefits.

    With a potential decrease in cash flow into the pockets of the welfare receivers or to the unemployed or to the disadvantaged ( in a myriad of ways) or to the person who just want's to make a decent living off, of his wages, yea...I think that I can understand that.

    But there's also benefits to more autonomy as well.
    But I think that, that would be best suited when an economy is off a little better.
    You'll be able to hopefully have more cash flow ready when and if you need it for the bad times ahead, yes??
    at least in this situation it might benefit the people from these islands.

    Here's the link:

    "God, from the mount Sinai
    whose grey top shall tremble,
    He descending, will Himself,
    in thunder, lightning, and loud trumpet’s sound,
    ordain them laws".


    John Milton (1608-1674) in Paradise Lost


    Ripley's SealLion's Believe it or Not! ~ NASCAR car crashes and Windows have just one thing in common.
    Oh, oh. Better use LINUX.
    Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
    Thanks

  2. Who Said Thanks:

    Mihai (12.01.10) , slikrapid (12.01.10) , saebrtooth (12.01.10)

  3. #2


    Join Date
    22.06.08
    Location
    astral planes
    P2P Client
    sbi finest
    Posts
    3,125
    Activity Longevity
    0/20 19/20
    Today Posts
    0/5 sssss3125
    The ballot in each of the two Caribbean departments called for giving local government more administrative freedoms, with Nicolas Sarkozy, the French president, to determine the extent of the autonomy.
    first the question, what autonomy?

    more administrative freedoms? what a joke

    the french president, to determine the extent of the autonomy? again, does this sound like autonomy?

    how about a real autonomy, like independence, like kicking out the foreign (this time french) colonialists back to where they came from? but no, they don't trust their own local government (you think the french didn't have any influence there?) and they are probably raised in the belief (convinced) that life without their colonial master is futile/unsustainable, guess what - thats what the 'master' wants you to believe

    the french government isn't interested in the prosperity of these countries - the colonialists simply want profit, territorial/economical/political/... influence, a nice holiday resort for the wealthy and so on - if someone thinks they care about the local (especially indigenous) population, think again
    Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
    Thanks

  4. Who Said Thanks:

    saebrtooth (21.01.10) , SealLion (13.01.10)

  5. #3
    Retired Seal
    SealLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    03.05.08
    Location
    The Arctic--Believe it!!
    Posts
    2,079
    Activity Longevity
    0/20 19/20
    Today Posts
    0/5 sssss2079
    Some of what you say is true, slik. However, I have to disagree with some of the other material there.

    I'd like to point out as an example, Greenland which, since 1979 has been under Home Rule from Denmark.
    Denmark is only responsible for security issues, foreign affairs, and I think also financial policies of the island.

    The rest, Greenland is responsible for.
    Basically, Greenland, as a country, runs itself ( with the few exceptions that I've made above. )

    In 2008, Greenland had a referendum for greater autonomy from Denmark after leaving the EU.

    in Short, Greenland developed greater autonomy from Denmark using small and deliberate steps to gain it's greater independance. Look,...it even left the EU. I don't know if it had to ask Denmark to do this or not, but that is just an example to illustrate how independant Greenland is now from Denmark. It makes it's own decisions on which economic region of the world it want's to belong to.


    I would tend to believe that things start of in small steps. Administrative autonomy is just one thing that could potentially lead to bigger and better things for small communities such as the one's made mention of in the article.

    Administrative autonomy could be defined as staffing for the local government or even planning for yourself, rather than have someone in Paris do the planning for the island community.

    As administrative autonomy is implemented, greater autonomy is introduced (via referendums) ...and so on and so on......

    I mean, for the French president to determine the extent of autonomy is a start. He's not going to be president forever. Someone will be there to replace him in some future election, yes??

    So as time and new presidents present themselves, newer opportunities for potential autonomy could also result.

    For the time being, the French might only be interested in the financial reapings of the islands.
    That's true.
    But like I say, as time goes by, things could/ would improve for the people.
    Full independence costs money too.
    I dont' think that any of the islands could even afford it right off-the-bat.

    There is also the logistics of full independance for the islands as well as.
    that takes time to plan and develop. I would believe that it starts with experience in independent administrative responsibilities that were given to the islands by France, sometime in the past.

    Hopefully, some new president in France would see things differently and give up more and more autonomies to the islands as time goes by. After all, nations aren't built overnight, yes??
    Last edited by SealLion; 13.01.10 at 01:39.
    "God, from the mount Sinai
    whose grey top shall tremble,
    He descending, will Himself,
    in thunder, lightning, and loud trumpet’s sound,
    ordain them laws".


    John Milton (1608-1674) in Paradise Lost


    Ripley's SealLion's Believe it or Not! ~ NASCAR car crashes and Windows have just one thing in common.
    Oh, oh. Better use LINUX.
    Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
    Thanks

  6. Who Said Thanks:

    saebrtooth (21.01.10) , slikrapid (13.01.10)

  7. #4


    Join Date
    22.06.08
    Location
    astral planes
    P2P Client
    sbi finest
    Posts
    3,125
    Activity Longevity
    0/20 19/20
    Today Posts
    0/5 sssss3125
    Quote Originally Posted by SealLion View Post
    Some of what you say is true, slik. However, I have to disagree with some of the other material there.

    I'd like to point out as an example, Greenland which, since 1979 has been under Home Rule from Denmark.
    Denmark is only responsible for security issues, foreign affairs, and I think also financial policies of the island.

    The rest, Greenland is responsible for.
    Basically, Greenland, as a country, runs itself ( with the few exceptions that I've made above. )

    In 2008, Greenland had a referendum for greater autonomy from Denmark after leaving the EU.
    naturally, there are many ways to accomplish different levels of independence & autonomy - the reason why Greenland had a 'peaceful' history during the colonization period is their lack of leadership with power that would have had to be defended from danish colonial power, which made it easy for the danish government to establish their rule over that region - if it can be done peacefully, why bother to wage wars

    yet, through the very act of colonization they imposed various new values (economic/religious/governmental/intellectual/...) on the indigenous people, virtually turning them away from their traditional values towards a new 'capitalist' system, which through the following years changed the local society step-by-step into a modernized replica of the colonial originator system

    i already mentioned the exploitation aspect before

    basically, the danish have no right claiming that territory, it belongs to the inuit native/indigenous population, but ofc in the similar way every colonization agenda ends up - the new settlements are being made, populated with newcomers and after a few decades this new constellation of power & the situation is taken 'as is' and ratified as valid for the future generations to obey/acknowledge

    a side effect of years of colonization is the mentality shift in the native people called 'internal colonization' where they accept the new values & system as the only possible or viable, ie. they were made to believe that without it, they wouldn't be able to live independently by themselves, yet their forefathers miraculously succeeded on their own - what a paradox (this is similar to the nwo methods as stated in the phrase: save us from ourselves)

    an insightful article on greenland's colonialization history, its effects & realities behind political decisions can be read here:

    COLONIALISM AS SEEN FROM A FORMER COLONIZED AREA
    Robert Petersen

    Abstract. The concept of colonialism and its effects are discussed from the point of view of Greenlandic experience. Problems arise when the ideology of the colonizers is adopted by the colonized peoples themselves, especially by the educated individuals who are more likely to be employed in positions of influence. Colonialistic attitudes and policies persisted in Greenland even after the end of the colonial period and the establishment of Home Rule. Neo-colonialism and internal colonialism are compared.


    Code:
    http://arcticcircle.uconn.edu/HistoryCulture/petersen.html

    this would all be a small problem when the foreigners decided to form purely trade/commercial co-operation with the native people, but they were aiming at colonization, exploitation, territorial expansion, ruling & influence over the area and so on - this caused significant changes considering the indigenous people on many levels of their existence (personal/society-wise/spiritual/intellectual/...), so even if they gain increased levels of autonomy the damage has already been done during the previous decades of colonial reign - also, make no mistake, the ownership (land, companies, institutions,...) in the (former) colonized countries is never fully returned to the rightful owners, so their dependent status continues on a less visible level (and there may be other relics, like privileged trading with the former? master - a good general example is the commonwealth, or religious connection to lets say the vatican, or as absurd as it may seem, 'god save the queen' anthem relics - all british examples)


    Full independence costs money too.
    I dont' think that any of the islands could even afford it right off-the-bat.
    it only does within the new established monetary/system paradigm enforced by the colonialists, thus the subservience seems inevitable, yet as said before, the indigenous forefathers miraculously succeeded to live on their own

    incidentally, self-sufficiency is something the globalist powers fear the most as their influence cannot easily penetrate such a society - their goal is the perpetuating debt-plagued society & dependence on external entities concerning different levels (military, financial, economical,...) of the local system
    Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
    Thanks

  8. Who Said Thanks:

    saebrtooth (21.01.10) , SealLion (13.01.10)

+ Reply to Thread

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may post new threads
  • You may post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •